Ready to take your career to the next level? Tune in to this empowering episode where we unlock the secrets to supercharging your professional journey!
In this episode, we delve into the strategies and insights that can turbocharge your career growth, whether you're just starting out or looking to make a significant leap.
We’re joined by Laura Atkinson, Partner, UK&I Alliances and Ecosystem, EY. Laura leads the Alliance and Ecosystem team at EY UK&I. Working with strategic alliances partners to deliver growth, support capacity and capability, Laura is instrumental in driving innovation for clients. Previously, Laura spent over 25 years in the software industry, delivering integrated, partner-led innovation.
She is committed to supporting diversity, equity and inclusion and is the partner sponsor for the EY Reading Women’s Network.
SheCanCode is a collaborative community of women in tech working together to tackle the tech gender gap.
Join our community to find a supportive network, opportunities, guidance and jobs, so you can excel in your tech career.
Ready to take your career to the next level? Tune in to this empowering episode where we unlock the secrets to supercharging your professional journey!
In this episode, we delve into the strategies and insights that can turbocharge your career growth, whether you're just starting out or looking to make a significant leap.
We’re joined by Laura Atkinson, Partner, UK&I Alliances and Ecosystem, EY. Laura leads the Alliance and Ecosystem team at EY UK&I. Working with strategic alliances partners to deliver growth, support capacity and capability, Laura is instrumental in driving innovation for clients. Previously, Laura spent over 25 years in the software industry, delivering integrated, partner-led innovation.
She is committed to supporting diversity, equity and inclusion and is the partner sponsor for the EY Reading Women’s Network.
SheCanCode is a collaborative community of women in tech working together to tackle the tech gender gap.
Join our community to find a supportive network, opportunities, guidance and jobs, so you can excel in your tech career.
Hello everyone, thank you for tuning in Again. I am Kayleigh Batesman, the content director at she Can Code, and today we are discussing how to supercharge your career. In this episode, we delve into the strategies and insights that can turbocharge your career growth, whether you're just starting out or looking to make a significant leap. Thankfully, I've got the amazing Laura Atkinson, partner at EY, who leads the Alliances and Ecosystem in the UK, and she's with me today to discuss this further. Thank you, laura, for joining us. Thank you for having me. Thank you for taking the time out. I'm sure you're super busy with your role at EY, so thank you so much for taking the time out. Can we kick off with a bit of background to set the scene, to tell a little bit about you and how you got into the industry, please, of course.
Laura Atkinson:So what I will say is that I am in the tech and IT industry by complete accident. Actually, it had no purpose behind it.
Kayleigh Bateman:Here is often.
Laura Atkinson:To be completely honest. So I did. My degree at university was international history and politics, which is what I loved. I loved history at school and that was my degree, believe it or not. The preferred route from my degree was MI6. I'm not exactly. I mean, that was where MI6 tended to recruit from. I don't really want to do that at the time and the forms you had to fill in worked just horrendous. So I thought, well, instead of that, I'm just going to apply to half a dozen graduate schemes. And I did, and I think I applied to British Airways, kimberly Clark and I ended up getting on the graduate scheme with ICL International Computers Limited, who are now a fidget super, and I haven't looked back. So I hadn't set my mind on a career in tech per se, but it was a brilliant graduate scheme. It gave me the opportunity to go and do lots and lots of different things and I found myself really enjoying it. So that's the best part of 30 years later, I'm still here.
Kayleigh Bateman:Amazing. It's always good to hear stories like that because there are so many ladies and so many guests that we even have on here that say you know, you're meant to know everything by university, you're meant to know what you want to do and where you want to go, and actually you didn't know. You know until you started looking at graduate programs, which I think the more that we tell those stories, the more ladies in technology will think you know what. I don't have to have it. Also Now, I don't have to have had the computer science degree. I can still come in.
Laura Atkinson:I didn't know anything about technology and I mean nothing, so you know and you can learn it on the, on the job, and I think that that's the other really interesting thing about a career in tech is it doesn't have to be at all technical. You know, there are so many assets to the kind of career that you can have in in inverted commas, the IT industry, which are which are very, very non technical and in fact I have a technical job in 30 years.
Kayleigh Bateman:And did you think that before you joined, or when, when you, when somebody said to you, you know you started looking for jobs in the tech sector, did you immediately think I'm not technical and then perhaps, when you started looking at the rails, you actually had to. I don't need to be?
Laura Atkinson:Well, what I knew I, what I knew I did want to do, was have a career in sales initially, and so it was sort of sales graduate training programs that I was applying for, all graduate training programs of which I knew there was a sales component, and there's a very good sales component at ICL. So that may maybe quite naively actually was sort of the overriding factor in the graduate schemes that I was applying to. But I think once I got into the industry, I think I really quickly realized that it would have longevity for me for a couple of reasons One, I think, because of multiple different types of roles that you can have in a career in IT, because there's just there's just so many different assets to the to the industry, and the second being that it just changes all the time. I mean there is no way you can get bored in this industry because it is very nature is massively evolving and in fact we're a point in time now.
Laura Atkinson:I think you know, with, with, with, how much everyone's talking about AI, ai etc. It's just it's unbelievably interesting and it does mean you have to learn a lot and it does mean you have to be up with quite a lot if you're going to sound credible, etc. And but that's what's kind of kept me here for 30 years. I think it's working for a couple of companies that I've absolutely loved and I've been there for a long time and just the fact that it's always really different.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, because I wanted to ask you a little bit about what. What makes the industry so interesting for you to work in, and you sum it up there the range of roles, and it changes constantly and I suppose as well that's. That's that misconception of working in technology that it's going to be technical, you're not going to know much change. I think a lot of people have that view on the tech industry before they get in, I'm assuming as well as somebody else that works in the tech industry. I got to travel a lot. The salaries are quite good. Did you know all of those things as well before, before you came in? Or did you think I didn't? I travel this much?
Laura Atkinson:But very mind I, I did sign the tech industry any 30 years ago, I'm quite told, and you know the world is very, very different then. I mean there was no mobile phone. I mean I got given a pager right for my first day. There was no. There was no way to do your email on the go, there was no, I mean. But there was such things, a mobile phone with apps right, they all have fun and they're all you pulled out of the top of them and if you wanted to do some email at night you have to come home, unplug your phone out of phone line and plug your ethernet cable in. So I think the industry was really really different then. I think it's a lot faster moving now.
Laura Atkinson:But I think once you get into a large firm, a large corporate IT firm and I've been very fortunate to work big companies you suddenly all of a sudden you realize there are sales roles, there are marketing roles, there are operations roles, there are management roles, there are training and education roles, there are alliances roles, which is what I've kind of made my career in, and all of that. None of those things are technical data programmers, computer science it's actually something that are plenty of those roles as well, but there are so many different things that you can go and do All under the kind of the IT umbrella. I don't think I'd really appreciate that when I first started and I have had the opportunity to travel, which has been fantastic. I think there's actually more opportunity to travel today and there was kind of even 10 or 15 years ago, if you want to do that.
Laura Atkinson:But I think the other thing for me as well is I don't know, we'll perhaps come on to this, but you know I'm a working mum. For many, many years I've been a single mum and the ability that I have had to really balance my working life and my home life is something I've really tried to take control of and be really purposed about. So it kind of fits in with me, you know, and for me, the ability to be the sort of mum I want to be to my children and have really good financial security are the two overwhelming factors for me in all of my job choices, and IT certainly tech. You know tech career has has an ability to do both things.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, I completely agree. I think more ladies and more mums should know that. I've had quite a few guests on here who are mums or have retrained in tech on the maternity leave and I've all said, you know, actually even retraining on maternity leave when their children were young has given them the freedom to be the, as you put it there, the months that they wanted to be, and even ladies when their children are grown older, just to be able to have that flexibility. I think more and more mums should know that that's tech industry. Definitely In terms of your career, you've had a very successful career. What do you think is the most important factor in supercharging your career?
Laura Atkinson:So I'm going to say I'm going to say three things here which I think are very, very important things. I think the first thing that's very important for your career is self belief, and I meet so many women, not just in the tech industry, but in multiple industries just don't have enough self belief and they think, oh, what I've got to say might not be as relevant as the other people around the table, and so they don't speak up. And I also meet a lot of women, especially slightly younger females, I think, in industry that I think often start their contributions in meetings with I know I'm really new, but or this might be a silly question, but and those are two, I would say some police dogs. Just don't say that, because all the other people are doing here is I'm new, I'm necessarily right to them. So that kind of more calm, confidence and self belief, I think is really important to give yourself a really good foundation for your career, and I wish I could go back like 25 years to say that to myself.
Laura Atkinson:Laura, you did know what you were talking about. So contribute, all right, contribute. So I think self belief is number one, I think a focus on your personal brand is number two, and that is so, so important. And again, I speak to a lot of women who say I'm so busy I haven't got any time to spend on my personal brand or my net worth.
Laura Atkinson:Yeah, doing the day of the do and actually think 100%, because you're people think of my brand, not your eyeballs, but you have got to focus on it. And for people listening to this thing, when they say brand, what do they know? What does what does she mean? The way to think about it is this your personal brand is what people say about you when you are not in the room. Okay, so what do you want people to say about you're not in the room? And how you do your job is as important as what you deliver.
Laura Atkinson:I think, and I have been quite purposeful about my brand and trying to create the right kind of brand for me. And then my brand is about my personality, about my energy, about how I contribute as well as what I contribute. So I think you must take time to think about your brand is really important. And then the third thing, the final thing, is I think it is absolutely crucial to be really purposeful about what you want out of your career and from your employer. And I only started doing this in anger about 12, 15 years ago. Before that, I sat there and I thought, well, surely they'll consider me for the job because I'm sitting here and I work really hard and they're bound to have noticed that and I can't believe. Nobody's asked me and I've done all these amazing things and that just wasn't working for me. Especially not in tech, where it's incredibly busy, where you've got large, complex organisations, you have to be really purposeful about saying to your manager I love my job, this is what I want to do next and this is where I want to go.
Laura Atkinson:And since I started being really bold and having those conversations with professionalism and humility right, not like, oh my God, I'm amazing, just give me the SEO job. But you know, I've done this, I really feel I'm ready for the next step. This is the impact. I think I've tried. This is kind of where I want to go. My career has really taken off. I've got the jobs I've asked for and I've even during my interview process for that job, then talked about the next job that I want after that. And I think that, especially, I do speak to a lot of females who never ask or think they're bound to be noticed. So I think having that being really purposeful about what you want, with professionalism and humility, and you've got to have a bit of track record in order to kind of give you some leverage that is really important.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, I love that. I absolutely agree that so many ladies sit in those roles and think you know what. But I've done everything my employer is going to ask me and I think once you realize that as well, that your employer is not a mind reader and also it's not for them to sort of sit and try and figure out even where you want to go. I mean, you know employers can help with personal development and they can try and figure out what you want next. But I completely agree, unless you state what you want to do next and where you would like to go with your career and I love the fact you mentioned the next job as well afterwards, because we don't always think about that how is the next job going to lead me to the next one? And the next one, because you're absolutely right and I think it's okay to mention that in an interview as well that you're not going to stay in that job forever and I need to know where I want to go next Completely.
Laura Atkinson:You know, I can remember I was having an interview for one job and the gentleman interviewing said, you know, it's a bit, it's a very, it's a very standard interview question. You know, where do you want to be in five years time? And I just said, well, do your job Right. Yeah, and you know what he said. He said, oh, brilliant, I'm just repeating my slate plan at the moment, so I'll put you down. I was like, okay, amazing, but I think you've got to just again. You've got to kind of edge out of your comfort zone because it does feel very uncomfortable when you're talking about you know how good, you know how good you are right. That doesn't come naturally to a lot of people and I feel often if it was really uncomfortable talking about it. But then I think, well, no one else is going to talk about it. So I have to sort of, you know, to convey the things that I think I'm good at and the impact I'm having to the business, the outcomes I've done, I'm delivering.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, I agree, and I think as well. Ladies find it harder to have sponsors as well in the workplace. So if you haven't got a sponsor in the room that is there when you're not kind of singing your praises and talking about everything that you're doing, if you're finding it hard to find a sponsor that's going to do that on your behalf, then you really need to step up and do that yourself, even if you do feel quite comfortable doing it yeah, absolutely.
Kayleigh Bateman:And some of that comes into. I said I wanted to ask you a little bit about soft skills and are soft skills important for getting ahead in your career? And I suppose one we just talked about there was this communication and communicating with your team and how you come across. I said soft skills are incredibly important, aren't they?
Laura Atkinson:Do you know what? I am so, so happy that you've asked this question, because I think a lot of females in particular think my skillset is somehow less worthy for senior roles than my male counterparts. I somehow I should feel a bit embarrassed by it. And I'll tell you a short story from many years ago in my career where I was working with a whole bunch of men mainly, I think that we were about kind of like less than 10% females and we were all having to do one of these psychometric tests where it kind of tells you what your style is, what sort of person you are, and at the end of the test you got labeled as being a red, green, yellow or blue person and you got a stack of bricks that were glued together like giant Lego bricks which you were then supposed to display proudly on your desk, which would tell everybody what sort of person you are.
Laura Atkinson:And blue was a data driven I'm a data driven individual. Green was about sort of people I'm a very people skills person. Yellow was harmony I like everything to be calm and happy, and it's really important that people are happy. And red, the tagline on the red brick was be bold, be bright, be good, which basically made coming impress me Get out again.
Laura Atkinson:And everybody in the room wanted the red brick on the top of their bricks right, and you could see as they were handing out these columns of bricks. You could see the relief sort of water over the men. You know. When they got the red brick on the top, my stack of bricks was yellow on the top by a country mile. I just want everyone to be happy. It's really important to me that everybody feels good and I put my bunch of bricks in my drawer and I never got them out ever again, because I was really in that span Fast forward kind of 20, 25 odd years.
Laura Atkinson:The last one of these tests that I did, my top three skills came back as supportive, caring and loyal and my number four was decisive. I'm so proud of that. I was so proud that I put that everywhere on myself. We were encouraged to do that. You know, put your top three, top four skills. You know the corners of the slide.
Laura Atkinson:So people now have to talk to you and you know we need more supportive and caring people in business. And actually those skills, those softer skills, make me really good at my job, because my job is to be really supportive with ecosystems and with our alliances and getting them to be really successful as well as going in why to be really successful. So you know, I had a complete turnaround in that perception of importance, as these softer skills, which I think people can feel really, you know, not embarrassed about, but they don't feel they're anything worth shouting about I absolutely refute that. I think, you know we need more people in business who are really great listeners, have got good EQ, are good at communicating, are really collaborative, but want people to feel really good in their jobs Very, very important. So you've got to celebrate all of that, I think.
Kayleigh Bateman:Definitely and even to, and that diversity of thoughts and that diversity of styles on a team can be so valuable. I think as well just retaining staff, I mean, imagine if your entire team or, you know, all of your managers at work were all the reds they all had the reds. You know what your day would be like you know, you wouldn't be able to retain really good talent if everybody there was a red brick. So to have that diversity of different coloured bricks and different coloured skills is so valuable.
Laura Atkinson:Really important yeah.
Kayleigh Bateman:And some of that soft skills also tie in with giving feedback. It's always an awkward topic, giving feedback. I know a lot of people struggle with it and asking for an acting on feedback is a great way for a continuous improvement. But do you have any advice on how to ask for feedback?
Laura Atkinson:It's a really good question because, again, it's not something that comes naturally to everybody and I think you know my views on this will be. I think it's really important to seek feedback, and seek it often, I think. Don't be afraid of it. I think it's also really important to seek feedback from people who are really different to you, and you know there are people that I know I say can you give me some feedback please? I know what it's going to say and it will largely be, I hope, good feedback. There are other individuals in my company where, if I ask them for feedback, I couldn't guarantee what they were going to say. But actually that's the feedback that's really important because that's my brand, that's my personal brand for those people that I want to know, I want to know what it is and I want to know any course corrections that I might need to make. So I think, unless you're working in a company that does have very formal end of year review tools and feedback tools brilliant you know you can pick and request a really broad selection of people to give you feedback. If you're in a company that doesn't have those sort of feedback tools, then I think it's a great idea to send an email out to people you know asking for a little bit of time and just saying you know you like to reflect every six, nine, 12 months, whatever it is, on your performance and on your impact to the brand. I think impact's a really good word to use for that and, you know you'd be really grateful if they could spare you some time and share their thoughts right, and I think that's really important, and I think it's very important to them be able to adapt your style to multiple different style personas within the business so that you get the best result. And I think we touched on it a little bit earlier in terms of seeking feedback or getting some coaching.
Laura Atkinson:I think getting a good mentor is really important. It's just so important. If you're going to supercharge your career, you must have a good mentor, and if you're listening and you haven't got one, get one. So tomorrow, because it's so important. And I've had many different mentors in my career, different stages of my career, and at times I've had more than one because I've needed them for very different things.
Laura Atkinson:So I think it's really important to get a mentor, but as well as that, I'd again encourage people listening to think about who is also my advocate, who is my ambassador in the business, because you need both. You need to think about do I have? Can I sit here and think of two or three people who might know would say, in a meeting without me there, oh you've got to talk to Laura about that. I mean, she's amazing, right, and she's done this and this and this and she's great.
Laura Atkinson:And if you can't think of some people that would do that for you, you need to go and try and cultivate that relationship and because they are then giving feedback on you again more broadly into the organization. So I think it's really, really important to have both of those people and definitely, definitely, always, always, use the feedback tools that you have to try and get as much as possible and, as I said, don't be afraid of it and just sit and reflect on it, and then you can discuss your feedback with your mentor or with your coach or whatever, and think about the things you might need to, you know, change.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yeah, and I think some of these things as well we mentioned earlier. They disappear in the day to day, but they're so important. Just going to somebody and asking for feedback can really change the way that you go about your day to day, instead of just keep doing the doing and you get to the end of the year and you think actually, you know, I haven't reflected on anything that I'm doing or I haven't found a good mentor to help me with something, and all of that, as you said earlier, that all ties back into your personal brand and I think sometimes just setting that even that new year's resolution of I'm really going to take notice of my personal brand this year and try and build that into everything that you do can make such a difference.
Laura Atkinson:Yeah, and I also think you know, give feedback as well. I think it's really important and perhaps again, this is, you know, back to my strength supportive and caring and loyal. You know I often dropping people quick emails saying brilliant point you made in that meeting, or absolutely love that email or this is fantastic, you know, massive improvement on before. You know I'm loving what I'm seeing here. You know I'm trying to give people that positive, encouraging feedback a lot and I think if you, if you start to give it, it's then you will be. You will hopefully get some in return as well. So I think it's really, really good to give positive feedback. And I also think you know one has to be brave and give difficult feedback if it needs giving to people. And you know I've had to do that many, many, many times in my career and it is difficult, but it's a really good learning experience as to when you you know when you have to do that.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, I agree on the difficult feedback. We had a chat about that on the podcast recently and it does depend as well. Feedback changes through the way that the company changes and we had a conversation on here. For instance, feedback is very different given to a company of you know, 20 to 30 people, and then when you get to 600 people, it's given in a very different way. You might have different mechanisms to give feedback and especially if it's negative feedback. So I completely agree. It is something that sometimes is very necessary, but it's just learning how to give that feedback is an important part of your career.
Laura Atkinson:It is and actually kind of a side note on that as well is if you sometimes have to write your own end of year appraisal. You know often you have to do that work. You know what have you done this year, what have you been proud of? I think it's really important to look at the language that you're using and is it a bit apologetic or are you making enough of what you've done? Are you really showing the impact that you've delivered and the so what of the work that you've done?
Laura Atkinson:You know, say, you know, like you might say, I might say I've worked really hard and, you know, hugely improved the relationship with our analysis this year. Right, okay, great, so what? Right, so we've increased the size of the business by 76%, yeah, and so I think often, again, women cannot be as sort of bullshit they may need to be in terms of giving their feedback, and I think it's really good to kind of reread that or get someone else to read your end of year assessments, appraisals and all that, just to make sure you're not selling yourself short your language or with the extent of your achievements.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, you're right. Somebody else might step in and say hey, did you know? Actually what you did was amazing and you've, you know, put in one bullet point about what you did this year. So you're asking the feedback on your own appraisal.
Laura Atkinson:Yeah, and it's the same with your CV. Actually it's the same with your CV, you know. Again, you know I read so many CVs and I've helped people with their CVs where they sort of sent me a first draft and I'm like, hang on a minute, you've made your job look really small and actually it's absolutely massive and you've got to put loads of numbers and percentages and metrics into that CV so people can see the size and the scale of what you're doing. And even if the size and the scale of what you're doing isn't very big, you know, in percentage terms it might be really impactful. So I think it's. You know it's good to be, it's good to be on the front foot with your feedback.
Kayleigh Bateman:It's definitely around the side of things and a lot of that feeds back into soft skills and what we were talking about earlier as well, and some of that leads into those. Soft skills are very connected to networking and I wanted to ask you a little bit about do you have any networking tips? Some people really struggle with networking. It is quite especially if you're an in-person event. That's quite difficult just to walk up to somebody and try and make a connection there. Do you have any tips for that, either online or in person?
Laura Atkinson:It is difficult and again, I do hear a lot from Finals it's quite difficult for us because we don't go to the golf events and we don't want to go to the bars and everything after work or what have you, and it is hard. I think there's your network and then there's networking. So I think the only thing that has not the only thing, one of the many things that has kept me sane in the last 30 years is having a really strong female network around me and you've got to build that wherever you are. Wherever you are, you've got to build as a woman in business, in tech, you've got to build a really good, small, trusted network of other females around you. It is massively helpful and will save your sanity on pieces. So that's very, very important. I think.
Laura Atkinson:On networking, it doesn't come naturally to everybody.
Laura Atkinson:It is hard and you kind of just have to take a bit of a deep breath and realise that everybody is networking and you can choose not to, but it won't be massively helpful for you.
Laura Atkinson:You've just got to go, introduce yourself to people, ask them some questions about themselves and what they do, and don't be afraid there to say, oh, I'd really love to go, I'd love to connect with you, or would it be okay if I just grabbed your email address and find out a little bit more about what you do, because they're talking about themselves and so you know, whatever, I've met interesting people, and they don't necessarily to be very senior, but you think actually that could be.
Laura Atkinson:It could be really useful connection for me to have. Then, you know, all you've got to do is ask them if they'd be really happy to share a few insights about their career and don't necessarily even have to offer them anything return, and a lot of the time people would be really happy to talk about themselves because they, you know, because they love it, and nor do I think you know one. You should beat yourself up if you're not going to the dinners or you're not going to the bars because you've got to get home for your children. I mean, that's been my life for as many as I can remember, and so you know you don't have to put yourself under pressure to do that, as long as you're doing a little bit every now and again, I think it's so important there as well that you split that into network, your network and networking, because you are right, some people find networking incredibly awkward, some that comes naturally.
Kayleigh Bateman:But I think it's where you think that your network has to be huge and that you have to connect with everybody. And, as you said, just a small that tribe that you can rely on is far more valuable than just randomly meeting people.
Laura Atkinson:You know it does. And also the other thing I would say is take the pressure off yourself If you're only three or four years into your career you are not going to have to use that work. You haven't been around long enough, you know, and you know when you've been 30 years into your career, like me, you know I've got a fairly big network. It's only because I'm so old. I've just been at work for a really long time and so I just know a load of people.
Kayleigh Bateman:I can't handle this. Laura is not out.
Laura Atkinson:It's a very janky me and my manager who works for me. He said it would be a miracle if we meet someone you don't know these days, because I do know quite a lot of people, but that is over three decades of work, so you can't fast track it, you can't rush it. You're not going to have hundreds of thousands of connections on LinkedIn. You know immediately, but it is quality, not quantity, all the time, and so you've got to cultivate what you believe to be your quality relationships.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, definitely. And on that note, are there any quick tips or things that Alice and his can do today to get started in supercharging their careers? Networks will take some time Networking can take some time for sure.
Laura Atkinson:So let me give you one little tip that I use often with people that I speak to about their career, and if any of them are listening to this, they'll be oh gosh. You know we've heard this before, but I think a really good way to think about how you might need to make a few tweaks or alterations to be your career is to draw a triangle on a page and there are three points to that triangle and you want to write the initials A, p and I on each of those three points. And a stands for authority. How much authority do you have when you speak? Okay, artwork, do you know your subject matter? Do you feel confident in it? Are people going to listen to what you said? Because you're talking with authority. The P stands for your presence. What kind of presence do you have? What sort of presence do you have? One to one, Like we're talking now? What presence do you have in a meeting, in person, online? What sort of presence do you have in front of a very large audience, either on stage or as part of a networking event? And, you know, do you need to make any tweaks or anything to your demeanor, to the way you speak, to your delivery, et cetera, to improve your presence. And then the final one, the I is impact Okay, and you can have impact in one of two ways at work.
Laura Atkinson:You can either have emotional impact or you can have intellectual impact. Sometimes you have both. I've got quite good emotional impact On a good day. My intellectual impact is okay, but you know, I've genuinely got quite good emotional impact and I've got quite. I like to say I've got quite the presence and I hope I've got a bit of authority because I know I really know my subject matter. But all I say to people is think about where you might need to tweak each of those little free dials. What's the thing you need to work on? Because you might be sat there thinking, well, I know I'm an absolute subject matter expert, but I don't deliver it with much emotional impact. Or I, I, I, I, I am waver locked, but maybe I need to tone that down to be a bit more intellectual impact. All there are things I need to do to treat my presence. So that is a really quick, fine thing I think that you can think about as an individual. To think about actually, what are the little things I might need to change.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, that's a brilliant task for people, just just to just to get started on, I think, as well as some of those things, you immediately, your mind immediately, goes to be, you have to be a very outgoing personality, you know, and you have to. When you said about presence, you know, I think a lot of people would think do you have to be the loudest in the meeting? And you know you have to shut people out of their way and you have to be the one with the big personality. But that's not always the way, is it? Everybody has different leadership styles and all of those three things that you said. Actually you can do all of those in your own leadership style and just tweak them Absolutely.
Laura Atkinson:And I mean you know, let's, let's. You know I spent a lot of my career at Microsoft. Let's use Bill Gates as an example of that. Is he really loud? Is he really arm wavy? Does he shout a lot?
Kayleigh Bateman:I mean he employed a lot of people that did that, you know which would be a counter part of it.
Laura Atkinson:But but you know, Bill, I was very fortunate to take some customers into me Bill Gates at a Microsoft terrifying moment, but he had the most incredible presence. He spoke with utter authority and he had a huge amount of intellectual impact, right, and a bit of emotional impact, but he but Bill was very clever and he employed a lot of people, I think, and that did a massive actually. He's amazing and and he's quite quite a leader. So I think if you're sat there thinking, oh gosh, I'm not sure I fit the stereotype, or you might be sat there thinking, oh, maybe I'm a bit too loud. I think there's that, my authority and my intellectual impact. You know it takes, it takes all sorts of people to to, you know, to lead and and deliver value to businesses and not everybody wants to lead.
Laura Atkinson:Not everybody wants to lead and you put yourself under pressure to to do that. So so I think you know you've got to. You've got to stay true to your authentic self and be really proud of the skillsets that you found. I find a great vehicle for those skills, because they won't all be the same as everyone else.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, definitely, and I love that just being authentic to who you are. And you're right, Bill Gates, and I remember when you hired Steve former, you are right, there were people in the company that did wave their arms around and I remember seeing him at an event and he was running up and down and he was sweating and he was shouting. I love this company the absolute opposite to Bill Gates, but very clever.
Laura Atkinson:He had a team that was very different and I saw Steve Farmer running around shouting many, many times and he was completely opposite to Bill Gates. Between the company got the barrette of two completely different leaders and there was something for everybody. And and that's the other thing I think you know, when you think about your career is think about who you want to work with and ideally there should be as little overlap in the Venn Diabrile skillsets as possible, because then you really complement each other and business gets you know a huge range of different skills and ways of working and impact to deliver the value and the results that you're trying to drive. But yes, it was a very different styles at the leadership table. Microsoft backing me up. That's been behind about 20 years, yeah, but that was a really interesting place.
Kayleigh Bateman:We are almost out of time. I've got one last question I want to ask you. Is there anything you wish you'd known before starting your career?
Laura Atkinson:I think that comes back to a couple of things I've already mentioned. Actually, I wish I'd had a bit more self-belief. I wish I'd been more purposeful earlier in my career and take control of my destiny. I let the first 15 years of my career happen to me, as opposed to trying to steer it. I was kind of taking along in the cup Super happy, by the way, really happy. I've been very fortunate, I've worked as a company with fantastic people, but I kind of let it happen rather than taking stock and thinking about actually what I really want and what value can I really bring and how do I go out and articulate that and be really purposeful?
Kayleigh Bateman:Yes, there must be so many listeners as well who are thinking I can relate to that. How many of us just kind of get in that Not a trap? As you said, people are very happy and very happy in their careers, but perhaps they're not thinking about the next job or the next one and they're not speaking up about what they would like to do. I think there are so many people that feel that way.
Laura Atkinson:I do, and you don't always have to have a plan. You don't have to be yourself under pressure to have a two-year, five-year, 10-year plan. I'm not sure I'd let that happen, but I think you've just got to think about actually where do I want to be that's going to allow me to do my best work, I can be my authentic self and I can use my skillsets really well to benefit the business that I'm working for. I think if you take a really good look at that, your career path or certainly maybe the next job or the next plus one job, will become fairly obvious for you, and then you go out and ask for it.
Kayleigh Bateman:Yeah, I think you should go out and ask for it. Going out and ask for it is lovely advice to end it on A really, really positive note there. Thank you so much, laura, for taking the time to chat. It's been absolute pleasure. I could talk to you for another hour or so, but we are already out of time. Thank you. Thank you and to everybody listening as always. Thank you so much for joining us. We hope to see you again next time.